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Multiple-zone audio management - System Level Audio
Next Meeting - Thursday
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8 July 2021 - 11:30am CEST
Click to Join Webex meeting
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- Access code: 297 637 101
- Meeting password: 92839687
Agenda
- Progress on external-system designDiscuss design of audio→external system, WebRTC based demo and "desktop audio development environment"
Thursday 1 July - 11:30am CEST
Participants
Suhasini RaghuramPiotr Krawczyk Gunnar Andersson
Apologies
Unknown User (niskandar) (+ 2 more weeks)
Minutes
- The full diagram of discussed plans has been posted by Piotr.
- It includes Audio-offloading and desktop development environment ideas, as discussed...
Thursday 24 June - 11:30am CEST
Minutes
- Very short meeting due to apologies and absences
- First draft diagram by Piotr coming via email. To be shown and discussed.Check what can be prepared and demonstrated for the next Virtual All Members meeting
Thursday 17 June - 11:30am CEST
Participants
Unknown User (wassim.filali) Suhasini Raghuram Philippe Robin Piotr Krawczyk Unknown User (niskandar)
Minutes
Discussion about the work
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- Should be more concrete than the big picture such as
- configuration of audio zones
- environment for building the framework inside the system
- environment for building the framework outside the system
- PitorPiotr: I would start with high level design for these tasks first
- like controlling audio zones, volumes, context
- design of trout based development (from an architecture point of view of course this is not important)
- but does trout support audio?
- it's a nice basis because the framework will not change, so the development can be taken to other HW easily. for example in an emulator, the framework was changed
- cross VM is an advantage (it's used in Trout)
- closer to what we want to develop in future
- closer to real use case
- This is where the trend is going
- get a portability of Android with trout (but not other OS)
- we need to check what is the real platform that we would work with in the future
- we need to check the good reasons to select it
- Wassim: I would focus more on policy and logic management specially for our GENIVI group
- Focusing also on versions of Android in the background and what would they offer
Thursday 10 June - 11:30am CEST
Participants
Unknown User (wassim.filali) Suhasini Raghuram Gunnar Andersson Philippe Robin
apologies: Unknown User (niskandar)
Minutes
Discussion on the workbreakdown structure, PoC Milestones and Work Breakdown updated online
Thursday 27 May 2021 - 11:30am CEST
Participants
Unknown User (wassim.filali) Gunnar Andersson Philippe Robin
apologies: Unknown User (niskandar)
Minutes
Discussion on the project organization and workplan and on how to foster engineers' engagement in day2day work, outcome of the discussion will be reported in the next call
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Participants
Gunnar Andersson Suhasini Raghuram Unknown User (niskandar) Stephen Lawrence Philippe Robin
Minutes
Small discussion about the AMM
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Thursday 29 April 2021 - 11:30am CEST
Participants
Philippe Robin Gunnar Andersson Piotr Krawczyk Suhasini Raghuram Unknown User (wassim.filali)
apologies Unknown User (niskandar) Stephen Lawrence
Minutes
preparation of AMM last session - discussion on the topics for next 6 months
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Participants
Philippe Robin Gunnar Andersson Piotr Krawczyk Suhasini Raghuram Unknown User (wassim.filali) Unknown User (niskandar) Stephen Lawrence
Minutes
Synchronizing from last weeks' status
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Participants
Philippe Robin Gunnar Andersson Piotr Krawczyk Stephen Lawrence Suhasini Raghuram Unknown User (niskandar)
Minutes
Overview of the last weeks
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Thursday 8 April 2021 - 11:30am CET
Participants
Stephen Lawrence Gunnar Andersson Unknown User (wassim.filali) Philippe Robin Suhasini Raghuram
Apologies
- Wassim has investigated webrtc with some simple implemementations
- Wassim: This could be transformed into a "proper" project. Maybe hosted on github/GENIVI?
- https://github.com/SoundHacking/web_py_loop – Gunnar Andersson to review if this fits into GENIVI repos.
- Documentation here: https://www.homesmartmesh.com/docs/sound/
- Wassim describes two designs, one on WebRTC, and another which is more decoupled and simply uses fixed parameters for the encoding. In an environment where the bandwidth is assumed to be more controlled and less variable, then the dynamic features of WebRTC are not needed.
- Both ideas are implemented and can be compared. All examples use the 00_backend (loopback) as server except for example 07 which uses 00_signaling server. Wassim to update readmes.
- Interesting tool https://w.dspconcepts.com/audio-weaver
- Development tool with target framework to execute the scenarios (on-board firmware)
- Audio experts make a flow using GUI tool, by connecting and configuring processing blocks.
- Not open-source. Likely business model is target license-fee for production use
- Some DSPs, are supported.
- For ST Electronics hardware, the license is included.
An inexpensive ST Microelectronics dev. board can be purchased and used directly: STM32f407 user guide.
(but there is also the option to run it on PC only) - ... discussion about which other DSP hardware platforms might be supported. This is not clear on the web site (need to contact the company?).
- Wassim says he knows it supports production grade DSPs, but apparently these are not public information(?), so we cannot describe it further.
- Stephen: I found that Cadence is listed, that's all
- You can generate the config/script and send it to the target systems.
- The target systems have an audioweaver DSP code.
- Documentation is available.
- Suhasini: Can the tool run the scenarios on the PC (a simulator/emulator environment)?
- Wassim: Yes, all "blocks" can be executed on the PC with a "x86 target"
- It might be interesting to support our "development environment" (described above and in minutes 2 weeks ago) integrated with this?
- Wassim: (bottom line) Whether it is exactly this one or another, this type of development environment would be ideal.
Thursday 1 April 2021 - 11:30am CET
Participants
Gunnar Andersson Unknown User (wassim.filali) Philippe Robin Suhasini Raghuram
Apologies
Minutes
- review of the planning of presentations at the upcoming AMM
- TODO Wassim and Suhasini will prepare a (5 to 10' mn) report on Audio HAL project status
- TODO Wassim will contact Piotr and check with him how to deliver a demo on External Audio management at the upcoming AMM
- Wassim: Android 12 is now being published
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Thursday 25 March 2021 - 11:30am CET (AUDIO_HAL_CW2112)
Participants
Piotr Krawczyk Gunnar Andersson Stephen Lawrence Unknown User (wassim.filali)
Apologies
Unknown User (niskandar) Philippe Robin
Minutes
- Piotr discussing that the HAL implementation might just as well target Trout since it is progressing quickly
- Google's virtual platform for Android "Trout", is likely to implement VIRTIO-SND
- Trout is based on CrosVM (developed as part of Chromium). CrosVM is in turn based on KVM when running on Linux.
- Trout is great and will make HALs portable without/less rewrite (Piotr)
- ...but the complexity of hardware compatibility and porting then lands on Hypervisor and Virtual Platform implementations instead (Gunnar)
- (Note Automotive Virtual Platform Specification already requires VIRTIO-SND in the working-copy, to be released in new version soon)
- VIRTIO-SND proposal is merged to VIRTIO master branch but no VIRTIO v1.2 document exists yet. Seems very likely to be included since it is merged.
- VIRTIO-SND kernel driver exists but implementations on virtual platforms (QEMU) still lacking. Part way done on Trout it seems...
- It is being developed but we can't rely that it will be done for AMM demo.
- Plan is therefore to use a simplified VSOCK transfer instead, exporting the audio. (A step in the right direction since VIRTIO-SND implementations are likely to use VSOCK)
- The plan remains to start building a framework for external audio and as a first implementation set up a WebRTC server running on the "host" that can consume the data from the VSOCK connection.
- The usage of WebRTC also fulfils a desire from Wassim to build a flexible simulation/processing/tinkering framework that can be executed on developer machines by way of a Web browser providing the user interface. (i.e. not only production, but development tools support).
- Why WebRTC?? Summarized:
- Easy demo - just "send a URL to someone, they open it in web a browser". It is also convenient way to create a user interface
- Bigger context: Create an abstraction of target sound environment, which may develop into a flexible (desktop) development environment for exploring/developing audio related functions.
- (Gunnar added offline): The fact that "real" Android is still part of this abstract development system makes it relevant for developing and testing real audio functions. I imagine you could even do Hardware in the loop setups...
- But also: WebRTC might be a possible actual "production" protocol for audio connection to a remote server. (Example use case that needs this: off-board speech processing)
- Pulseaudio? Might be an easy solution to implement some of the control channel parts for the demo.
- NEXT : Need to start breaking down the design into more details, included software components
- 1) Find existing implementations of component parts (e.g. WebRTC – Unknown User (wassim.filali)mentioned there are implementations available, let's point to them)
- 2) What parts still do not exist - need to be developed
- And of course: Confirm the overall demonstration use case and plan to guide the breakdown.
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Participants
Gunnar Andersson Philippe Robin Stephen Lawrence Suhasini Raghuram
Apologies
Unknown User (niskandar) Unknown User (wassim.filali)
Minutes
- Wassim sent a link before the meeting. A very useful documentation page describing the principles for Audio Focus in the latest AOSP is this page:
https://source.android.com/devices/automotive/audio/audio-focus - Quick updates for Suhasini who is 'glad to be back'. Continued focus on external-audio track is good.
- We reviewed last week quickly and decided to do offline reading of the documentation and come back next week for more discussion.
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Participants
Chris Simmonds (part) Gunnar Andersson Philippe Robin Piotr Krawczyk Stephen Lawrence Unknown User (wassim.filali)
Apologies
Minutes
CI/Testing
Gunnar: Shortly about Go issues sorted out. Both Lava and Go.CD updated to latest versions. Go now behind NGINX proxy (it used to handle its own SSL/TLS but this is more standard). Some breakage to sort out -- large artifact transfers were being truncated, etc. NGINX settings sort this out.
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Participants
Gunnar Andersson Philippe Robin Piotr Krawczyk Stephen Lawrence Unknown User (wassim.filali) Unknown User (niskandar)
Minutes
Introduction from Philippe
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Participants
Minutes
Thursday 18 February 2021 - 11:30am CET
Participants
Unknown User (wassim.filali) Stephen Lawrence Philippe Robin
apologies: Gunnar Andersson, Nadim Iskandar, Suhasini Raghuram, Piotr Krawczyk
Minutes
Discussion on AVB/TSN and hypervisors and virtio between Wassim and Stephen; will continue next week
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Participants
Unknown User (wassim.filali) Gunnar Andersson Unknown User (niskandar) Stephen Lawrence Philippe Robin Suhasini Raghuram Piotr Krawczyk
Minutes
Update regarding the platform
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Participants
Unknown User (wassim.filali) Gunnar Andersson Unknown User (niskandar) Stephen Lawrence Philippe Robin @Chris Simmons(2net)
Minutes
Discussion about
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Participants
Suhasini Raghuram Unknown User (wassim.filali) Gunnar Andersson Unknown User (niskandar) Stephen Lawrence Philippe Robin
Minutes
Discussion about the AVB and next steps or topics to do (but we cannot reach the conclusion without Piotr)
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Participants
Suhasini Raghuram Unknown User (wassim.filali) Stephen Lawrence Piotr Krawczyk Gunnar Andersson
Apologies
Minutes
Review of the backlog for audio HAL
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Participants
Suhasini Raghuram Unknown User (wassim.filali) Stephen Lawrence Piotr Krawczyk Gunnar Andersson Unknown User (niskandar)
Minutes
Philippe: talking about the FOSDEM presentation, if some time is left we could mention the backlog tasks.
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Thursday 17 December 2020 - 11:30am CET (AUDIO_HAL CW50)
Participants
Gunnar Andersson Philippe Robin Suhasini Raghuram Stephen Lawrence Piotr Krawczyk
apologies: Wassim Filali, Unknown User (niskandar)
Minutes
How to get help on the Kingfisher board
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Participants
Gunnar Andersson Philippe Robin Unknown User (wassim.filali) Suhasini Raghuram Stephen Lawrence Unknown User (niskandar)
Minutes
Virtual open source conference. GENIVI was recommended to give a talk (Fosdem: biggest open source conference). If we submit anything to the Embedded Mobile and Automotive dev room, we need to have strong code examples.
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Participants
Gunnar Andersson Philippe Robin Piotr Krawczyk Unknown User (wassim.filali) Suhasini Raghuram Stephen Lawrence Mohan Karthik Unknown User (niskandar)
Minutes
Continuing the session about Network Audio Synchronization and answering questions
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Participants
Gunnar Andersson Philippe Robin Piotr Krawczyk Unknown User (wassim.filali) Johan Suhasini Raghuram Stephen Lawrence Mohan Karthik Chris Simmonds Unknown User (niskandar)
Minutes
Wassim giving a session about Network Audio Synchronization (many additional information came from Mohan Karthik)
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Participants
Gunnar Andersson Philippe Robin Piotr Krawczyk Unknown User (wassim.filali) Unknown User (niskandar)
Minutes
Going through the list of prioritized topics:
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Thursday - 5 November - 11:30am CET
Participants
Gunnar Andersson Philippe Robin Stephen Lawrence Suhasini Raghuram, Unknown User (wassim.filali), Chris Simmonds
Minutes
Review of the list of prioritarized topics
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Thursday - 1 October - 11:30am CEST
Participants
Gunnar Andersson Philippe Robin Stephen Lawrence Suhasini Raghuram Henric Carlsson
apologies: Unknown User (wassim.filali) Unknown User (niskandar)
Minutes
Review the work breakdown structure and update it to get a shared knowledge of the project status before preparing the agenda of the AHAL working session at the tech summit
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Participants
Gunnar Andersson Philippe Robin Stephen Lawrence Unknown User (wassim.filali) Suhasini Raghuram Henric Carlsson Unknown User (niskandar)
Minutes
Updates from last meeting:
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Thursday 17 September - 11:30am CEST
Participants
Gunnar Andersson Stephen Lawrence Henric Carlsson Piotr Krawczyk Unknown User (wassim.filali)
Minutes
Discussion on demo implementation status
Thursday 10 September - 11:30am CEST
Participants
Gunnar Andersson Stephen Lawrence Henric Carlsson Piotr Krawczyk Unknown User (wassim.filali) Philippe Robin
Minutes
Discussion on configuration & demo building & integration of the emulator project, followed by Jira review
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Participants
Gunnar Andersson Stephen Lawrence Henric Carlsson Piotr Krawczyk
Minutes
Discussion on feature content for MS3 demo (MS3 = virtual tech summit scheduled on October 26-30) Gunnar Andersson can you add the notes you took during the call ? thanks
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Participants
Gunnar Andersson Stephen Lawrence Henric Carlsson Piotr Krawczyk Unknown User (niskandar)
Minutes
Going through the previous minutes of the meeting.
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Participants
Suhasini Raghuram Gunnar Andersson Stephen Lawrence Unknown User (niskandar)
Minutes
Going through the previous minutes of the meeting.
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Participants
Philippe Robin Suhasini Raghuram Unknown User (wassim.filali) Unknown User (niskandar) Stephen Lawrence Piotr Krawczyk
Minutes
Going through the previous todo list:
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Participants
Philippe Robin Gunnar Andersson Unknown User (bartoszbialek) Suhasini Raghuram Unknown User (wassim.filali) Unknown User (niskandar) Stephen Lawrence
Minutes
Alternative board for Suhasini, any upadte on that matter?
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Participants
Philippe Robin Gunnar Andersson Piotr Krawczyk Unknown User (bartoszbialek) Henric Carlsson Suhasini Raghuram Unknown User (wassim.filali) Unknown User (niskandar)
Minutes
Should the minutes be more like a transcript?
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Participants
Unknown User (niskandar) Gunnar Andersson Unknown User (zafirulhassan) Piotr Krawczyk Unknown User (bartoszbialek) Unknown User (zafirulhassan)
Minutes
Looking at the history, the best course of action here is to go through the Jira tickets and assign them to start working on them.
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Participants
Unknown User (wassim.filali) Philippe Robin Gunnar Andersson Piotr Krawczyk Unknown User (bartoszbialek) Henric Carlsson Stephen Lawrence Suhasini Raghuram Unknown User (niskandar)
Minutes
Let's start by going through the points that we have gathered last time in PoC Milestones and Work Breakdown.
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Participants
Unknown User (wassim.filali) Unknown User (niskandar) Philippe Robin Gunnar Andersson Piotr Krawczyk Unknown User (bartoszbialek) @Henric Unknown User (zafirulhassan)
Minutes
Introduction to members and new member Zafirul
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Participants
Suhasini Raghuram Unknown User (wassim.filali) Unknown User (niskandar) Philippe Robin Gunnar Andersson Piotr Krawczyk Unknown User (bartoszbialek) @Henric
Minutes
Debriefing of the virtual summit
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Participants
Suhasini Raghuram Unknown User (wassim.filali) Unknown User (niskandar) Philippe Robin Andrii Chepurnyi Harald Bartholomae Ruslan Shymkevych Gunnar Andersson Piotr Krawczyk @Henric
Minutes
Going through the presentation of Wassim
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Anchor AUDIO_HAL_CW18 AUDIO_HAL_CW18
Thursday 30 April - 11:30am CET (AUDIO_HAL_CW18)
| AUDIO_HAL_CW18 | |
| AUDIO_HAL_CW18 |
Participants
Philippe RobinSuhasini Raghuram Unknown User (wassim.filali) @Henric Ruslan Shymkevych
apologies: Piotr Krawczyk Unknown User (bartoszbialek)
Minutes
Review of Ruslan's email of 23 April - archive
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Anchor AUDIO_HAL_CW17 AUDIO_HAL_CW17
Thursday 23 April - 11:30am CET (AUDIO_HAL_CW17)
| AUDIO_HAL_CW17 | |
| AUDIO_HAL_CW17 |
Participants
Philippe Robin Piotr Krawczyk Unknown User (bartoszbialek) Suhasini Raghuram Unknown User (niskandar) Unknown User (wassim.filali) @Henric
Minutes
Updates of the tasks done from last week: Wassim, Piotr, Nadim
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Anchor AUDIO_HAL_CW16 AUDIO_HAL_CW16
Thursday 16 April - 11:30am CET (AUDIO_HAL_CW16)
| AUDIO_HAL_CW16 | |
| AUDIO_HAL_CW16 |
Participants
Philippe Robin Gunnar Andersson Piotr Krawczyk Unknown User (bartoszbialek) Suhasini Raghuram Ruslan Murtazin Unknown User (niskandar) Unknown User (wassim.filali) Andrii Chepurnyi @Henric
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- Discuss the gathered topics, who can work on which topics and which strategy
- Status update on the "access raw streams"
Minutes
Changes done in this page Android and System Level Audio:
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Anchor AUDIO_HAL_CW15 AUDIO_HAL_CW15
Thursday 09 April - 11:30am CET (AUDIO_HAL_CW15)
| AUDIO_HAL_CW15 | |
| AUDIO_HAL_CW15 |
Participants
Philippe Robin Gunnar Andersson Piotr Krawczyk Unknown User (bartoszbialek)Andrii Chepurnyi@Henric Suhasini Raghuram Stephen Lawrence
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- from last week's minutes
- Discuss the gathered topics, who can work on which topics and which strategy
- Status update on the "access raw streams"
- AOB
- abstract of the GENIVI virtual tech summit AASIG Audio HAL workshop
Minutes
list of gathered topics on multi-zone audio management
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Thursday 02 April - 11:30am CET (AUDIO_HAL_CW14)
Participants
Philippe Robin Gunnar Andersson Piotr Krawczyk Unknown User (bartoszbialek) Unknown User (wassim.filali) Andrii Chepurnyi Unknown User (niskandar) @Henric Suhasini Raghuram
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- Slides from Wassim about the two models inside and outside of AA
- discussion of the cases/features that we are trying to solve
- checking the Audio Manager to decide whether or not it needs an update
Minutes
- 2 strategies or options:
- android provides sources and sinks
- Android controls the complete systems
- We will not discuss the need to have such options
- Basically some functions cannot be integrated to AA
- Audio sources coming from android or from external (android not aware of them)
- Each strategy has limitations and can be criticized
- Idea is to get each model and apply to it questions/cases
- Questions like safety sources, raw streams, etc.
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